Lars Larson: Obama Keystone call looks crazier and crazier

 Lars Larson: Obama Keystone call looks crazier and crazier

by Lars Larson

The President’s turn down of the Keystone pipeline looks crazier and crazier, the more we learn the details.

Yes the President turned down the Keystone XL pipeline. A $13 billion project promising, immediately, 20,000 jobs.

Well Rep. Joe Barton from Texas decided to dig in on that. He got the chance to interview, in front of a congressional committee, a woman from the State Department – the only U.S. agency that turned it down.

See, EPA and about a dozen other agencies said there was no problem, but the State Department has a say because the pipeline crosses an international border.

He said to the woman “So what was the objection, safety or some fear of a disaster?” She explained there just wasn’t time. To which Rep. Barton replied “We fought and won World War II in less time than this administration has taken to consider the Keystone pipeline. There’s been plenty of time and the President’s excuses are running pretty thin.”

For more Lars Larson, visit Lars’ web site

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Posted by at 05:00 | Posted in Energy, President Obama | 22 Comments |Email This Post Email This Post |Print This Post Print This Post
  • Pantsonfire

    Why are you mean to a man who finally stood up the big oil and did a brave thing to help save our nation?
    This pipeline will leak and be a problem.
    I just know it.
    So, rather than be critical, we should applaud his courage.

  • MrPower

    If everyone would do his or her patriotic duty and buy a Volt we wouldn’t be in this mess.

  • Bobbridgens

    Panysonfire sounds real intelligent.

    • crabman34

      Oh please.  Pantsonfire is just a less articulate seemingly-liberal (or just libertarian-opposed-to-Keystone?) version of Rupert.  Pantsonfire claiming that he “just knows” that Keystone will leak is like Rupert claiming that he knows Obama’s SOTU call for a mixed energy policy is a cynical request for money from a specific person or that Obama’s rejection of the Republican 60-day decision deadline was petulant.  Pantsonfire and Rupert represent opposite ends of the ideological spectrum, their pedantry quite different, but the style of the argument is almost parallel.

      The 60-day deadline was arbitrary and in violation of NEPA.  Big projects like this require reasoned analysis, State had a clear conflict of interest and didn’t do a good job on the EIS, there should have been better assessments.  A months-long delay, if the project is to go forward, is not really meaningful in this context.  It will take years to build this thing and get the oil to the Midwest.  It was the Republicans who were being petulant when they put a cynical and obviously not honest deadline into an unrelated bill.  Their goal, as always, was not good policy or doing right by America, but simply to try and make Obama look bad and win a talking point for the election.And, Bob?  Four-word comments that attack someone’s intelligence should probably be spell-checked at least once; perhaps in your case a couple of times.  

      • Pantsonfire

        I know it will leak because these things always do. Maybe not the first couple years, but after a decade or more leaks will invariably show up. They always do. To call me names for stating an obvious fact is nonsense. I KNOW it will leak, and you know it will leak, so let’s get that behind us and agree that O did the brave thing. We must save our earth and not pollute our lands only so dumb people can drive big SUVs.
        I have had it with big oil.

        • crabman34

          I don’t disagree with you, and I didn’t call you names.  I was just pointing out that your claim to knowledge without at least stating more than your conclusion is much like how Rupert argues.  It doesn’t help your cause, is all I’m saying.

          You could have bolstered your argument (although, I would understand why you don’t feel the need on this board) by pointing out how often pipelines leak, and the devastating consequences (see Yellowstone River leak last year).  

  • Bob Clark

    Actually, there was a point at which Secretary of State Hillary Clinton voiced support for this pipeline in the interests of national security.  But what with it being an election year and Obama needing the radical environmental vote, Obama took over the decision from the State department and sought to delay the decision to after this November.  The GOP saw a weakness here and placed an immediate “up or down” vote before the president.  This pipeline has been studied for at least two years or more now, and it is so obvious the decision to waffle on it by the President is purely political motivated.

    It is interesting as this decision to waffle and say no at this point may actually come back to hurt Obama’s election chances.  The U.S. economy is sort of boxed in.  If the economy tries to grow more robustly, gasoline demand moves higher along with other oil product demand; and yet this leads to higher gasoline prices, which has the affect of dropping consumer confidence and slowing the economy.  If the economy continues to grow around 3% or better, gasoline prices may be over $4 per gallon this summer;and with the president having vetoed this pipeline which adds a big chunk to U.S oil supply from our friends to the North, the optics of this may not play very well at all for Obama.  On the otherhand, if the economy grows more weakly then employment growth is very likely to stall also hurting Obama.  So, economic gorwth over the next six to eight months may have to stay in the narrow range of 2% to 3% for Obama to have a relatively easy time at re-election.

    One middle of the road thing Obama has done is talk up a switch in energy policy more towards natural gas.  He is saying we can manage the risks of the new natural gas drilling method called “fracking.”  If he weren’t in re-election mode, he probably would choose (and rightly so) to say we can manage this oil pipeline’s environmental risks.  Heck we have thousands of miles of oil pipeline already traversing the country, and we are not exactly an environmental basket case.  To think otherwise is to give little credit to U.S engineering know how.  What’s more, the natural environment has a built ability to repair itself, seeing how scientists were recently surprised how microbes in the Gulf of Mexico were key in helping clean up the oil spewed from the BP well blow out last year.

    • Rupert in Springfield

      The natural gas talk up I think was a sop for more money, in particular from T Boon Pickins. The fracking thing is a bit of a mystery as it tends to discount the argument that Obama is worried about losing the environmentalist vote. There is way more opposition to fracking in the environmental community than there is to Keystone.

      What I think Obama is trying to do is look like he is considering environmental concerns in order to retain their vote. That’s the only thing that really makes sense here as I think it would be pretty hard to argue having lots o’ fracking goin on is going to have substantially less environmental impact than doing Keystone.

      Any idiot could make the political calculation that you are going to lose way more votes in declining Keystone than you will through retention of environmentalists by the action. Obama is certainly well aware of this and is also aware the environmental community is largely a partisan one and hence have no where else to go.

      By talking up natural gas, campaign contributions aside, he shits environmental concerns to fracking rather than pipelines, but will not have to make any major decisions as it is unlikely some major new fracking endeavor with the jobs and economic aspects of Keystone will come his way prior to November. There simply isn’t going to be the “Trans Global Fracking Initiative” put up in that time where environmentalists can mount opposition and Obama will be put in the same position he is by Keystone.

      For current fracking operations Obama can express concern and adopt a “we are looking into it” posture that will largely sate the environmental lobby.  

      • valley person

        I know this is a hard concept for you Rupert, but think about it. Obama has to weigh both policy and politics.  He wants projects that create blue collar jobs. He wants greater energy independence. And he wants cleaner energy. Its not just about which path gets the most votes in a single election.

        If, in his view the pipeline is marginal on jobs, lousy on environment, and has no impact on oil price or availability (since it is a global market,) its a net negative project. If it is great on jobs, positive on energy price, and marginal on environment, it is net positive.

        Reaching a conclusion while weighing a lot of complex factors simply takes some time.

        • Rupert in Springfield

          >Reaching a conclusion while weighing a lot of complex factors simply takes some time.

          Three years is more than enough time. Let’s face it, if Obama was a Republican, you would be pointing out this very fact.

          You just simply can’t be critical of Democrats because you look at party first, the reasoning second. We all know that.

          • valley person

            “Three years is more than enough time.”

            Maybe. But many EIS projects smaller than this one take as long or longer. The clock starts on an EIS long before a final route is selected. Here you have a pipeline crossing our entire nation north to south. That is a lot of terrain, a lot of communities, rivers and wetlands to go across. It takes several field seasons just to collect all the data. Years of meetings with local communities to figure out what they want or don’t want.

            And if a decision is made that shortcuts the process, that is the surest way to get this project in court, where it can be tied up for many more years.

            “You just simply can’t be critical of Democrats because you look at party first..”

            And you just simply can’t stop repeating the exact same baseless charge whenever it suits you. Don’t you ever get tired of saying the same thing over and again? The fact is Rupert, there are Democrats on both sides of this issue, just like there are Republicans on both sides. Organized labor wants this project, environmentalists don’t. Republicans in congress want it, Republicans in Nebraska do not.

  • Rupert in Springfield

    It really boils down to petulance. Obama didn’t like it that the 60 day deadline was set by the payroll tax deal. He weighed the advantages of getting the election year albatross of Keystone off his neck now, with the disadvantage of having to do what Republicans had essentially told him to do, make up your mind within 60 days. As the president is notoriously thin skinned, he decided it would be better to have the uncertainty of Keystone hurt the economy than to have his ego bruised.

    Obama will go along with Keystone in the end, however there will have to be a face saving measure for him. This will consist of a re routing to avoid the sacred and hallowed ground of Nebraska.

    There were three options:

    1 – Decline Keystone in its entirety with the result the Chinese get involved with a routing through Canada. Obama will not do this as there is no way he can have the political liability of it in an election year.

    2 – Go along with the 60 day deadline imposed by the Republicans and say “OK, Keystone is a go!”. This would have been immensely popular, would have resulted in a real boost to peoples spirits economically, but also would have involved a cave in by the White House. We know what the president chose to do here.

    3 – Delay – Say there wasn’t enough time. This possibly tricks Republicans into thinking they have a juicy election year issue but it won’t happen. By delay and eventual approval Obama gets two things, he gets the plus of approval closer to the election and he gets to placate environmentalists with some sort of re routing.

    The disadvantage of delay is obviously it is bad for the country economically. However weighing that against saving his ego and playing it better politically Obama chose that option.

    I will be very surprised if Keystone is not eventually approved with some modifications. Obama will get his pound of flesh, his supporters will bob their heads with his masterful genius, and the country can finally get along with one aspect of digging us out of the hole we are in.

  • 3H
    • Rupert in Springfield

      Looks like most of the objections in the study synopsis could be applied equally to any infrastructure job. In other words, if we should accept the complaints expressed in the study, then why should not the same complaints by applied to virtually any “shovel ready” government infrastructure expenditure, such as the stimulus or stim2? Jobs would also be temporary, steel would also be largely imported, workers also largely non local. Seems to me if this is the standard, it is largely an argument that could be applied to a myriad of Keynesian road, bridge, tunnel stimulus type projects.

      • 3H

        “Looks like most of the objections in the study synopsis could be applied equally to any infrastructure job.

        I think part of the intent of the study, was to question the assumptions and conclusions articulated by Trans-Canada.  If they are overselling the project, I think it’s prudent to ask why.

        Yes, why not?  All factors need to be studied, thought about, and considered.  That shouldn’t be a bad thing.   We’ve already paid a price for not being a little more cautious in our actions, don’t you think?
        Are you willing to argue that we shouldn’t take a little time to consider the pluses and minuses in any project?  Weigh the pros and cons?  That we should just jump in and hope it all works out in the end?

        I also think there are a lot of jobs at the local and state level that have gone through the study process and now sit dormant due to a lack of planning.

        • 3H

          a lack of funding..

          LOL

        • Rupert in Springfield

          >If they are overselling the project, I think it’s prudent to ask why.

          I think so too, and frankly I think the figure of 20,000 jobs is probably overblown. However there would be more jobs from this than any project I can think of in the BO stimulus. 

          >We’ve already paid a price for not being a little more cautious in our actions, don’t you think?

          I would totally agree and have said so when such occasions have arisen. The stimulus cost a whole lot of money and provided no where near the jobs it was supposed to provide, as evidenced by it not holding unemployment below 8% as BO had forecast.

          Given that, would you say BO probably should not have spent $1T on the stimulus, or does this logic only work one way?

          >Are you willing to argue that we shouldn’t take a little time to consider the pluses and minuses in any project?

          Nope, no one is. However three years is not a little time. It’s a lot of time.

          >I also think there are a lot of jobs at the local and state level that
          have gone through the study process and now sit dormant due to a lack of
          planning.

          a lack of funding..

          I am not sure if you intended these two to go together.

          I am sure that almost any government ill is invariably blamed by the left on a lack of funding. It’s a familiar, if non constructive, refrain.

          Throwing money at it got us into this mess, it won’t get us out.

          • 3H

            No, I think he should have spent the stimulus, but perhaps directed it in a better direction.  I’m not sure how quickly they needed to shore up banking – it very well may have been a necessity –  but I’m definitely not happy at where it all went.  Think of me as a Krugmanian.  

            I’m not sure what you mean by does the logic only work one way?   Slightly different circumstances,   but I don’t know.   If all the banks had failed, that might have been a lot worse than taking time and not necessarily jumping on the Keystone project.   I meant to say there were projects that had gone through the planning process and were sitting unfunded at the state and local level.   Money spent on those would have done more, in my opinion, to have jump-started the economy.  Throwing money around did not get us into this mess.   The greed and avarice of the financial sector got us into this mess.  Their willingness to bundle up toxic mortgages, etc… is what lead to our current problems.Did you mean societal ill?   I think there are things that the government should be involved in.   Some things it shouldn’t.   I don’t think the “liberal refrain” is any less constructive than the “lower taxes and stop government regulation” refrain.  We tend to lose sight of the particulars when we over-generalize.   This, actually, is why when a commentator talked about excessive government regulation I wanted more details because saying “I’m against excessive regulation” really isn’t saying anything?  I think you could get 999 out of a 1000 people to say they were against excessive regulation – the devil is in the details. I think what has happened is that we have forgotten, or ignored (or in the case of people like Jonah Goldberg, simply rewritten), our history of when we had an economy and society that were largely unregulated by the government.  Regulations rarely happen in a vacuum, and frequently are the result of a problem.

            Just a friendly warning.. even if I agree with Obama on the stimulus, et. al., does not mean I’m in lockstep with him, or agree with everything he’s done.  One huge issue by example that, sadly, OC hasn’t touched on: I’m horrified, and appalled, at Obama’s insistence that the President has the power to order the execution of an American citizen simply on his say so.  No trail, no due process.  I’m actually sickened by it.   I don’t know why so many Democrats and Republicans are going along with it.   It will keep me from voting for him in this next election.   Even more sadly, I doubt the Republican running for President will be against that particular policy.

          • valley person

            It is hard to “hold” unemployment to 8% when it was well above that point before the stimulus went into effect.

  • valley person

    The main issue with Keystone is whether it is good long term energy policy for the US, considering all factors. Tar sand oil is very expensive and costs as much energy to produce (natural gas as it delivers).

    In addition the Republican leadership in Nebraska has lobbied against this project, so take your complaints to them.

    • Laughingintexas

      It is not any more expensive that the oil from the Saudis. Do the math.

      • valley person

        Tar sands oil costs $50-75 per barrel to produce. Saudi oil costs about $4 a barrel to produce. You aren’t paying $4 a gallon for gas due to the cost of producing Saudi oil.

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