Obama-Clinton-McCain: War of words over guns and liquor

Obama started with this comment at a San Fransisco fundraiser:“You go into these small towns in Pennsylvania and, like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years. “¦ And it’s not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren’t like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations”

Clinton replied:
“Someone goes to a closed-door fundraiser in San Francisco and makes comments that do seem elitist, out of touch and, frankly, patronizing,” and then re-affrimed her gun credentials by mentioning that she shot ducks with her dad as a child.

Obama replied on the photo of Hillary drinking Crown Royal:
“Around election time, the candidates can’t do enough — they’ll promise you anything, they’ll give you a long list of proposals and even come around, with TV crews in tow, to throw back a shot and a beer,”
…and then sniped on her hunting comment…
“She is running around talking about how this is an insult to sportsmen, how she values the Second Amendment. She’s talking like she’s Annie Oakley,”

John McCain’s senior advisor jumped in.
“It’s hard to keep a straight face when you’re accused of being out of touch by a guy who thinks the whole country is worried about the high price of arugula or that you hunt ducks with a six shooter,”

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  • devietro

    Hmm, Obama says that clinging to religion is a sign of being bitter? But he likes to mention how devoted to his church he is. So is HE bitter?

  • Chris McMullen

    I have a whole new respect for Mrs. Bill Clinton. She’s was pounding down shots with nary a grimace. Good for her!

  • Rupert in Springfield

    You know at some point with gaffs like “typical white person” and now this latest one, Obamas luster with the media as being smart and eloquent is going to wear a bit thin.

    This current fiasco, when combined with the fact that Obama’s church going seems to be confined to racist hate America diocese, is going to make people think long and hard at the polls come voting time. America is certainly ready for a black president, Obama’s initial thrillingness is testimony to that. What America is weary of is yet another black leader who seems to have a not so well hidden chip on his shoulder against people who don’t look like him.

    When Obama’s opposition, Hillary, can spend the week doing shots, talkin guns, accuse him of being the elitist and come out looking anything but a lunatic, that speaks volumes.

  • RinoWatch

    “Obama started with this comment at a San Fransisco fundraiser:”

    San FranSISCO?

    • dean

      It’s a city in Northern California, our most populated state. 750,000 people live there, with over 7 million in the metro area. Its known as the base of our entire high tech industry among other things. What…Presidential candidates should not visit there? They should be unrepresented?

      Rupert….scary black guy. That is the key message. Turn this skinny, intellectual, mixed race senator into a scary, Willie Horton/Al Sharpton/Louis Farakhan, mad at whitie black guy. That is your party’s best hope in 08.

      Meanwhile McCain, with “gaffs’ like “bomb bomb bomb Iran” and his right hand Reverend John Hagee (nuke Iran, bring on the Rapture) get a pass right? They are not scary because they are white guys and look like us? Whatever.

      Jerry….if we started over we would still end up with imperfect choices. Its the nature of the political beast we are all lashed to. People are unqualified to be prefect and always say or do the right thing.

      • Rupert in Springfield

        >Rupert….scary black guy. That is the key message. Turn this skinny, intellectual, mixed race senator into a scary, Willie Horton/Al Sharpton/Louis Farakhan, mad at whitie black guy. That is your party’s best hope in 08.

        Meanwhile McCain, with “gaffs’ like “bomb bomb bomb Iran” and his right hand Reverend John Hagee (nuke Iran, bring on the Rapture) get a pass right? They are not scary because they are white guys and look like us? Whatever.

        Wow – Dean – Dude, you really better check yourself a little. That’s about the most racist thing I have ever seen. Are you sure you are not in the Klan because damn dude, you definitely talk like a card carrying member. I was talking about Obama, not McCain, and yet you seem to think it fully within the realm of discourse to impute beliefs to me concerning McCain because of my skin colour?

        Lets get this straight – Obama is the one who has a continual problem making racist comments. Obama is the one who hangs out with an outright racist minister. I don’t have to make him to be anything, I merely have to repeat his words. You simply refuse to hear them, because you are a party member first, a thinker second and something of a racist ( based on this and similar racist comments you have made in the past ) third.

        • dean

          I think you know this, but my comment was facetious. Obama is not a scary black guy to me.

          Yes…I am absolutely sure I’m not in the klan.

          I would say what my point was on McCain…but you hate it when I say what my point was, so I won’t. Yes I will. What scares me more than any chip Obama might have against we honky homeboys (including his mom and grandparents I guess) is McCain getting his mitts on commander in chief so that he can start a third war in the Muslim world even while we are busy losing the first 2.

          But hey…no draft…borrowed money….shop till you drop. Why should I be worried about starting another war?

          • Rupert in Springfield

            Oh ok, I got it. I was arguing about Obama and you sought to divert from them by talking about McCain and making racist comments as kind of a joke.

            Works for me. Who knows, maybe that sort of thing will work in the polls as well. Given how people seem to be reacting to Obamas gaffs I tend to doubt it though.

            We’ll see.

  • Jerry

    I believe this whole situation points out just how completely unqualified either of these people are to be the next president.

    Can we start over on this??

  • CRAWDUDE

    He is quickly showing himself as a liberal, who has no respect for the beliefs of others. I’m close to predicting that the Presidency is Keating 5 McCain’s to lose regardless of who the DNC nominee is.

    Swing and moderate voters when generally go with the candidate that they believe isn’t on the extreme of their beliefs.

    I believe McCain is moderate to liberal, but Hillary and Obama are to the extreme side of liberalism, as has been proven. I think either one loses!

    Though it may not affect him right now, his latest gaff can be considered anti-small or at least made to look that way. This will hurt him big in the general election with midwesterners and hunting advocates.

    Those of us who chose to own firearms are not to thrilled when we are called ” bitter” because of it……………..and I’m not religous.

    The only religous, rascist zealot I’ve heard lately was been Obama’s spiritual advisor.

    P.S. I still think Hillary will get the nomination.

    • dean

      CD…take it from a liberal: 1) McCain is not one of “us” and 2) Obama is not very far “left” if you mean compared to the center of gravity in the US. Large majorities of Americans support: phasing out of Iraq, negotiating with Iran, dealing with global warming, expanding health insurance access, letting the Bush tax cuts on wealthiest Americans expire, retaining a woman’s right to an abortion, and keeping social security solvent and more or less as is.

      On these big issues of the day….Obama is well within the mainstream. McCain is a step or 2 right of the mainstram on all but one of these issues (global warming).

      Obama did not call you “bitter” because you own firearms. He said some blue collar Americans in small towns (you live in a big non rust-belt town) bitter because of industrial economic decline, and suggested some (implied white guys) may turn to other avenues (including guns and religion) for comfort. He is guilty of over-generalizing, nothing more.

      I’m not religous either. I do own a bb gun to help keep the racoons away from our ducks, and Jehova’s witnesses from the front door (just kidding).

      • Rupert in Springfield

        >2) Obama is not very far “left” if you mean compared to the center of gravity in the US.

        God God Dean, please pick up a newspaper. Put down the banjo and just step away.

        Obama is rated the most liberal Senator in the Senate. NPR even reported it so I would think you would at least be aware of it on that basis if nothing else.

  • CRAWDUDE

    He is very liberal and the GOP will inundate the airways with his statements and views if he win the nomination. Time will tell on that one.

    You can pretend that McCain isn’t liberal but the crossover vote during the election will be the deciding factor, again we’ll both know soon enough.

    He has been taking the rural areas of the competitive states he’s won , while Hillary wins the majority in the pop. centers. His comments, whether a gaff or a belief will be used against him to alienate him from the base he was hoping for.

    Actually, I am from a small town in the midwest;that would be Minnesota………….the state “ABOVE” Iowa, lol, lol!

    • dean

      Rupert….Senator Obama was rated as “most liberal” by a single analysis in a conservative magazine that used a very questionable methodology. I mean…is Obama really more liberal than Bernie Sanders, a self described socialist? Or Ted Kennedy? Or Barbara Boxer? Go back, look at the issues I listed, compare his position to where the public is, and you cannot conclude he is way out in left field. Or better yet, find me a sngle issue where Senator Obama is “far left” of the middle ground in American politics and report back, because I have studies his positions and I don’t know of any where he is out of the mainstream.

      CD…Obama looks and talks and acts like a liberal. He is a liberal as in “left of center.” But he is not out of the mainstream at all. If he was so liberal he would not be winning the non-liberal states in the primaries (Wyoming, Missouri, Kansas, Colorado, etc….He would be winning the big city states that Hillary has been winning.

      I know you are not FROM Portland CD, but you are a Portlander through and through. Lattes….micro-brews…the Blazers….you can’t fool me, gun or no gun.

      • Rupert in Springfield

        >Or better yet, find me a sngle issue where Senator Obama is “far left” of the middle ground in American politics

        Dean – Give me a break. You consider fully nationalizing health care and the instant ratifying of Kyoto to be the middle ground so anything I came up with would be pointless. I don’t know what would constitute far left to you, maybe establishment of the Soviet Gulag system or a Cultural Revolution over here but frankly anything short of that, and I am not even sure about those, you would consider moderate.

        Don’t try and reel me in with rotten bait like this. I am onto you, you sly dog.

        Or should I say….fly dawg.

      • crawdude

        Wrong! Carmel Machiato’s!

        • dean

          Rupert…can’t let you off the hook that easy. Let’s take the 2 issues you cited.

          “Fully nationalizing health care.” Good idea. Too bad Obama is not for it. He is for increasing access to the mixed public/private system we have by putting $50 billion or so a year into subsidizing insurance premiums for lower income Americans, expanding SCHIP, and preventing insurance companies from denying access to anyone who can pay the premiums. There is no individual mandate to buy insurance, but you would have to buy it for your kids. Oh…and he would allow our government to actually negoiate prices with drug companies so that our elderly can stop ordering drugs from Canada and Mexico.

          A national Kaiser poll in February found that 65% support Obama’s plan, 31% oppose. https://www.pollingreport.com/health3.htm

          I did not find a poll on whether we should “sign Kyoto” which every nation in the world but us and I think Iran and Saudi Arabia have done by the way.

          But on global warming, according to Gallup (March 6-9) 66% of Americans are concerned about it (that would include me, Obama, McCain, and Newt Gingrich,) and 33% are not concerned (that would include you presumably). https://www.pollingreport.com/enviro.htm

          So…we have the answer. Senator Obama is far left of Rupert. Not far left of the mainstream of Americans.

          For the record…I do not favor estalishment of a Soviet Gulag here. Remember, I’m a weenie, “effete” liberal who does not believe in putting people in jail because that would be mean.

          • Rupert in Springfield

            No, Dean, what we have established is that you have a complete inability to read a simple paragraph.

            I never said Obama for Nationalizing health care. Re-Read.

            I never said Obama for Kyoto. Re-Read.

            Both far left issues.

            Democrats lost congress over first, the second couldn’t get single vote in Senate. So far left of public otherwise public mad and closer vote.

            Got it? I try to parse down so word and sentence count short. Hopefully that help.

            Me not play your game of you not read and divert argument to thing you think can win.

          • dean

            As my mom used to say…”pardon me for living.”

            One could conclude Democrats lost Congress over their failed effort to expand (not nationalize) health care coverage. Or one could conclude they lost Congress because they failed to enact legislation after being elected to do so (it was a core ampaign promise Clinton made in 92).

            Interesting note on the Frontline piece on Health care last night. Switzerland essentially had the US health care system in place up until the early 90s. It was not working for the same reasons ours dos not work: high cost, poor coverage, too many cracks to fall through.

            They devised a new system with universal coverage and competition in part by taking profit out of the picture. They were strongly resisted by the conservative party, the drug companies, the doctors, and the insurance industry, which is very strong there. In a public referendum on the issue, the new program barely passed.

            15 years later satisfaction with health care is now very high. They have 100% coverage. And the conservative party has changed its tune and now fully supports the new program.

            On Kyoto….yes, it could not get a single Senate vote in the 90s. That does not mean it could not get a majority vote today. And it does not mean a majority of Americans would not support such a vote.

            OK…you are right. You did not say Obama was for neationalizing health care an dKyoto. In the context of our exchange over how liberal Obama is or is not, I misread your diversion to talking about me. Apology offered.

            By way of explanation, I am not for “nationalizing health care.” I am for establishing a single payer system, or failing that a mixed system that insures everyone.

            Kyoto is basically old hat. Itstime to move to stage 2 or 3.

          • cc

            Rupert,

            Ignore him – it’s essentially his tactic re your points.

            Let him argue with himself – he gets some sort of pleasure from it.

            Verbal onanism.

  • Boring John

    Remember that Dean is just a Greek Liberal that is educated and likes to banter………..he has lost a bet before and will loose another if he wants to bet on Obama vs McCain…are we on for another $10?

    • dean

      John…you old rich right wing rascal! Long time no see or hear. It was $20 last time. Sure. I’ll wager you $20….add some inflation…make it $25 that either Democratic nominee, Clinton or Obama….edges out McCain. I’ll meet you at the same pub after the election. Deal?

      Knowing you as I do, I would think you would not want “liberal” McCain to win anyway. Am I wrong on that? Your man Thompson sure was a bust.

      By the way…I think we are about to buy a tractor. Be nice and maybe you can borrow it now and then.

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